[Renegade Robins: Jason Todd] Mirror, He Wrote: Feb. 3-16

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Doug Moench took a week off…

This Renegade Robins Club (formerly known as Jason Todd Club) session comes straight from the pen of Jason Todd himself! See two Flash rogues (Mirror Master and Captain Boomerang) drop by Gotham! Watch as Jay teams up with Bullock! Behold the addition of Catwoman to the team! Witness the debuts of Dark Rider and Film Freak!

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Across the Community
  • Jason is hanging out at World of Bats this week, too. Batman needed a little help taking down Deacon Blackfire in The Cult, and the best Robin ever was willing to oblige!
Bird Sightings

Blue Devil Jason

Background

  • In addition to skipping a story recently covered by World of Bats (see below), we will also skip Batman #392 and Detective Comics #559 because they leave out Jason Todd and act as standalone stories. The important thing to know is that Catwoman is once again working with Batman.

  • Mirror Master was introduced in Flash #105, and as a member of the Injustice Gang, he’d faced off against the JLA. Captain Boomerang was introduced in Flash #117, and he’d previously faced off against the Dark Knight in Batman #322.

  • Bruce poses as gangster Matches Malone, which he has done on occasion ever since the death of the real Malone in Batman #242.

Captain Boomerang
"But where’s his pink unicorn?!"

Here’s our schedule: 2020-02-03T06:00:00Z → 2020-02-16T06:00:00Z

Week 8 Reading (Nine Issues)

Note: the crossover issues with Crisis on Infinite Earths were very recently covered by World of Bats, so a link will be provided to that discussion to avoid redundancy.

I. Bullock & Robin

  1. Detective Comics #554
  2. Batman #388
  3. Detective Comics #555

Link: Crisis Tie-In Story Discussion

II. Dark Rider

  1. Batman #393 (optional: no Jason Todd)
  2. Batman #394

III. Standalone Issues
6. Detective Comics #560
7. Detective Comics #561

IV. Film Freak, Pt. 1 (To Be Continued Next Week)

  1. Batman #395
  2. Detective Comics #562
Discussion Questions
  1. Doug Moench loves teaming up Jason Todd with Harvey Bullock. Do you enjoy this dynamic?
  2. How do you feel about the appearance of Mirror Master and Captain Boomerang? What other non-Batman rogues do you want Jay and Silent Bruce to face?
  3. From Darkwolf (in last week’s issues) to Dark Rider, we’ve been seeing an increase in international terrorists lately. Do you like these kinds of stories, or are you a “local villains only” person?
  4. How do you feel about the addition of Catwoman to the team? Do you think she meshes well with a Robin (in this story or others like it)?
  5. Speaking of superhero partners who also happen to be legacy characters, Black Canary has a new costume and a new outlook. Do you see any parallels between Dinah and Jason?

Jason Todd shirt reveal
"Alfred, he’s been doing this ever since he left the Fortress of Solitude."

Poll Question: Who makes the best dynamic duo?

  • Batman & Robin
  • Batman & Catwoman
  • Bullock & Robin
  • Catwoman & Robin
  • Arrow & Canary

0 voters

Batman 395 Jason
If you listen closely, you can hear the fourth wall breaking!

And see the long-awaited debut of the Damian Wayne side of our club right here: “Father. I imagined you taller.”

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I’ve only made it through the first three issues, but reading these stories with Bullock in them has really made me appreciate him as a character. It’s hard to believe that in all the decades he has been around he hasn’t changed that much. I think it is a testament to the strong supporting characters in Batman’s wake, but also to Bullock as a character. Gruff, a little clumsy, but a good and respected cop / detective.

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What’s cool about him is that he actually has been through an arc in this Moench run. He started out as a semi-willing stooge to oust Gordon by Mayor Hill, constantly butted heads, and when Bullock’s actions caused something terrible, he had a change of heart. He realized what he was doing was wrong and he became Gordon’s most adamant supporter as a way to atone.

I’ve liked Bullock as a character before this, but reading through this run really made me appreciate him all the more.

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I think I jumped on for the tail end of that arc with Bullock.

For a character that totally could have been, and probably was intended to be, a throwaway one and done character, he’s endured.

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Moench deserves credit for taking a throwaway character from one issue and turning him into the Bullock we love today.

Also, I hope everyone isn’t thrown off by the re-branding of the club. We’ve discussed it in private messages, but in case you missed those updates, I’ll just announce that we’re expanding the club to feature Damian Wayne stories in the weeks that I’m not doing Jason Todd stories. The schedule for the Jason Todd sessions will remain the same.

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Yes, Moench deserves the credit on that. I grew to love Bullock as a character because of the work Moench did with him.

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By the way, I know that I skipped Batman #392 this week due to a lack of Robin, but I would be remiss if I didn’t mention that the issue is listed as one of the selections in the new collection The Bat and the Cat: 80 Years of Romance.

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I was going to say, while it doesn’t fit with the club, I would recommend anyone who’s a fan of this era and of the Batman/Catwoman dynamic to read it, because it is a really sweet, fun story with these two.

In a similar vein, the Detective Comics issue of that same month, #559, is also pretty good, with a “double date” between Bat/Cat and Green Arrow/Black Canary. It’s definitely more heated, with some interesting butting of heads between Bruce and Oliver.

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I seem to remember it as being a great Bat/Cat story so I look forward to reading it again. I’m a longstanding fan of the couple since Cat’s first golden age appearence after all. :grin: Still love Dick’s reaction that whole original situation.

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Doug Moench loves teaming up Jason Todd with Harvey Bullock. Do you enjoy this dynamic?

Yeah, it’s pretty interesting, though it’s not just with Bullock – he had a similar dynamic with Nocturna as well, teaming up with her to save Batman a month or so back of this reading. I think he likes this dynamic with Jason for two reasons.

One, it creates some spicy drama for Batman and Robin: with Nocturna, they were being split up by CPS and Nocturna was trying to use it to her advantage to get with Batman, and here, Jason is feeling inadequate with Catwoman hanging around. Two, it allows for in the main stories to have Robin be his own character in the cast instead of just being by Batman’s side. It allows Robin to have his own solo stories in a way, but unlike Dick’s solo stories where they were pretty skippable and, honestly, not very good.

As for him and Bullock, it’s pretty fun. They make for a good buddy cop dynamic and they feel a little more at an equal level, each offering something different. While it’s technically a different continuity or whatever, it kind of makes me wish that Jason interacted with Bullock more often.

How do you feel about the appearance of Mirror Master and Captain Boomerang? What other non-Batman rogues do you want Jay and Silent Bruce to face?

It’s pretty cool – I think of all the other villains in the DCU, The Flash’s rogues are probably the easiest to transplant to Batman’s world, because they’re not all cosmic or supernatural world conquerors or anything, they’re just flashy robbers with varying degrees of psychosis, just like Batman’s.

From Darkwolf (in last week’s issues) to Dark Rider, we’ve been seeing an increase in international terrorists lately. Do you like these kinds of stories, or are you a “local villains only” person?

I like the international stories, but I tend to prefer them having at least a basis in Gotham, like something happens in Gotham and Batman finds it’s origins somewhere else and he investigates. In the Dark Rider story, I didn’t really like the fact that he was basically recruited by the CIA – Batman shouldn’t be at the beck and call of an organization like that.

But I think these stories are interesting in that it helps signifies a gradual maturation of these superhero stories. Now instead of just having costumed villains stealing weird stuff, but dealing with stuff that is cut from national headlines. It gives these stories a breath of realism which makes the fantastical elements more interesting – at least in my opinion.

How do you feel about the addition of Catwoman to the team? Do you think she meshes well with a Robin (in this story or others like it)?

It’s a little conflicting. On one hand, I do love the character of Catwoman and her dynamic with Batman, so it’s fun to see them together in stories. On the other, it does feel like once she’s around, all other partners seem to fall by the wayside. Maybe Moench better balances things out in future issues.

Another issue with this is that with Catwoman as a partner, it tends to kind of take away some of Catwoman’s edge. While I feel she isn’t a pure super-villain, she’s also not really a true blue super-hero. Seeing her on patrol with Batman kind of takes away a bit of her independence and charm. Thankfully it seems like recent runs like Tom King and so far James Tynion’s take on that partnership has avoided that.

I guess I would say that I like Batman and Catwoman together, but I think they’re at their best when they’re able to do their own thing. Partners, but not partners. Does that make sense?

Speaking of superhero partners who also happen to be legacy characters, Black Canary has a new costume and a new outlook. Do you see any parallels between Dinah and Jason?

First off, here’s my thought on that new costume in one image:

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Second, in terms of parallels, in these backups I guess you can say that both Jason and Dinah are trying to prove their worth. The difference being that Jason wants to prove that he’s still good enough to ride with Batman, and Dinah wants to be more independent, be able to do her crimefighting in her own way and not just work with Oliver.

So I guess they were trying to do the same thing for the opposite reasons. That’s kind of cool, now that I think about it. I doubt that the two creative teams were working together to make it happen, but a happy turn of events.

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I do love it when two writers wrote stories serendipitously connect like these do. I also think at this point that Jason’s new middle name should be “Parallels” because of how often parallels between himself and other characters come up.

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I really enjoy the dynamic between them. Love what Moench does with it and with the two characters as well.

I enjoyed their appearances here. I thought it was particularly funny that one of them thought that Gotham had no hero to protect it. That made me smile.

I think I’d like to see some more of Flashe’s rogues showing up in Gotham mainly because I like his rogues a lot.

I like both kinds of stories to be honest. Local villains are great but those sorts of adventures can get stale after awhile if a writer only sticks to the “locals” because they figure its what people want. I like a good story without the “locals” every once in awhile to liven things up.

I always did like it when Catwoman goes “heroic” for a time and works side by side with Batman. I think she has worked well enough with Robin over the years although here Jaylad is being a typical teenager in a snit because his partner is ignoring him in favor of a love interest. It’s really reminiscent of Dick’s reaction to her back in the day.

There’s a note of trying to prove themselves in both stories but as @Jay_Kay said they are trying to prove opposites.

  • Jason= Approval as Batman’s sole partner. He feels that is being threatened by Catwoman.
  • Dinah= Approval from Oliver that she can in fact hold her own and work independent of him. She feels Ollie is curbing her independence.
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As we wrap up this session, I just want to say I’m sorry that the Film Freak story is split between this week and the next one, but I didn’t want to overload either one with too many issues. (Then again, anyone who has read Knightfall knows that things usually turn out bad for Film Freak.)

Also, the upcoming session will be the final chapter in the Doug Moench run, which means that we’re slowly creeping into the post-Crisis era. If you’ve been with us since the first week, pat yourself on the back for having read three years’ worth of Batman and Detective Comics issues from November until now!

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Congrats to us all!

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I haven’t felt this much pride and accomplishment since Star Wars: Battlefront II! :laughing:

Seriously, while it’s sad to see him bow out (for now, I know he does pop back up plenty of times in the 90s), it is a cool accomplishment. :slight_smile:

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I absolutely love it. We’re smack dab in my personal Golden Age with these issues, and the scene where Robin is sitting in the Dark when Bullock comes in is one I’ve always considered iconic. It would be awesome to see Red Hood and Bullock team up for nostalgia’s sake.

Very enjoyable. This was the first time I ever met these characters. But why get Rogues just get along?

As for other villains, I think it could be cool to see Bat & Rob go up against the Toyman.

I do like them, especially Dark Rider. You have to mix it up, but the James Bond type Batman stories can be a lot of fun. I like seeing him pulled into new surroundings and out of his comfort zone. And it seemed like there’s a lot less fear and respect for Batman overseas than in Gotham. I wish we had seen Katia again…that was a character ripe for a recurring role.

I love it when Catwoman is around. Sure, she meshes well with Robin in the sense that she’s not supposed to. Too bad her team up with Jason here didn’t lead to any improvement in their relationship.

They’re both birds.

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Ending on a cliffhanger? How comic book-y of you.

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