[World of Bats] CASEFILE 001 -- Zero Year

I get more into it in my blurb, but the scenes with Kate and Bruce are definitely my favorite parts of that issue.

And I loved that Batsgiving image – as I recall, this was an advertisement for Batman Eternal, and like some other promos for big shows that were going on around that time, it has clues on where the story was going to go.

Do you mean Barbara Gordon, or full on her as Oracle?

Again, I go into it in my blurb for it, but some of the art for this is…special, to say the least.

If I remember it right, yeah, it deals with a lot of stuff that happens in Lobdell’s run early on.

I can’t believe I forgot to mention it! That was a great opener for this overall story – it really sells the eventual scale that this story will have. Plus, from what I remember at the time, when this came out people assumed that this would just be a long, dragged-out rehash of Year One, and it perfectly tells people it absolutely will not.

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Well, the original premise was Oracle providing information, support, and mission control, and Black Canary doing the fieldwork. That can support more field agents (like in the Gail Simone run), but without someone in the Oracle position the concept doesn’t have anything to make it distinct.

I read all of the tie-ins. For the most part, I would rate most of them “okay,” but I think Detective Comics with Gordon was really good. I also liked Catwoman and Batgirl quite a bit. My least favorite by far was Green Lantern. That was too heavy handed and didn’t hope my interest.

I also don’t get the New 52 Robin timeline. Are Dick and Jason the same age? Was Dick Robin for only 3 years or so? My mind can’t wrap around how all that supposedly worked.

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Do you really wanna know? :stuck_out_tongue:

Wow…Robins don’t last very long. Maybe the whole kid sidekick thing isn’t such a good idea.

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I mean, comic book timelines rarely, if ever, make any lick of sense, but the way they handled the Robins in the New 52 definitely pushed it. What’s funny is that Zero Year is actually the first time they started to kind of go against the whole “five years” thing, implying that with the events of Zero Year, Batman is the longest running superhero with six years.

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Jumped on two tie-ins I don’t think I read at the time, Catwoman and Flash.
Catwoman, first you have to love the Dodson’s work on the cover.


The story wasn’t exceptional but it was enjoyable. Selina does her Robin Hood stealing from the rich and giving some to the poor. The art has a nice sense of humor, and well choreographed fights.

I do love this little sequence, Selina is gonna be Selina.

Flash was a nice one and done crime story. Though I think we would have heard if he and Iris had meet in Gotham.


I like the touch of Bullock agreeing to keep Spenser’s secret. It’s not only a nod to his former partner, but it protects his wife and kids from GCPD going after his pension/insurance or a part of it since it might be argued that he did not die in the line of duty.

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Batwoman #25

Considering the circumstances of which this book came out, it’s really not that bad. From what I understand, this was very much a rush job, made after the original creative team of J.H. Williams III and H. Blackman left the book over DC not allowing them to let Kate and Maggie Sawyer get married. And it’s really easy to see, considering that there are at least four vastly different artists on this issue.

Still, it’s not a bad issue – the story of it is short and simple enough, it does what it needs to do. I liked the little scene that we get of Kate and Bruce interacting, if only because it was really a rare thing to see until Rebirth. But overall this issue so far feels the most unnecessary.

Birds of Prey #25

I haven’t read a lot of this era of the book – after Marx came in and suddenly made my favorite character in the book do a heel turn for literally no reason at all I gave up – but this issue is interesting enough. I get the feeling that if one is a Black Canary fan and is not a fan of how the New 52 took away her mother and JSA connections, you’re probably not going to have a good time.

Overall I liked it well enough. While it’s not the classic take on the character, this take on Dinah is interesting enough, and does a good job setting her up for how we would see her in previous issues of Birds of Prey, Team 7, and ultimately her (far superior) solo series.

Catwoman #25

I had dropped this book around this time shortly after Ann Nocenti got on the book, who did some…interesting things with the book, to put it lightly. In comparison to that, this basic, kind of paint-by-numbers issue is a godsend in that it actually made sense!

While I feel like Selina here was portrayed as a little too green than she should at this time period, it was still a good take. She has a good balance of looking for the next score to set her up, while still having her own unique code.

I also liked the story’s sense of continuity. Much like Layman’s criminally underrated run on Detective Comics, it takes bits that were already established in previous runs and slips them in a way that feels natural, from adding in Lola, Selina’s first fencer from Judd Winick’s run of Catwoman, to the Gotham Underground that was a big part of Nocenti’s aforementioned wacky run. It even references Layman’s own Detective Comics tie-in to Zero Year effortlessly – much easier to do since, y’know, he wrote the thing, but still pretty cool!

The art by Aaron Loprasti is also great – I normally associate his work with Wonder Woman, but he does a great job of making Selina very expressive, and pulls off the alleycat Selina, and the classy/sexy high society Selina.

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My solution would have been to drop Jason and Damian from the New 52 continuity* and start Snyder’s Batman #1 with Dick’s final adventure as Robin before leaving for college with a new superhero identity, but no one listens to me.

*My even better solution would have been to treat the New 52 as an “Ultimate Marvel” type universe that ran in some titles while others remained in the pre-Flashpoint timeline, but again, no one listens. In this scenario, the New 52 universe wouldn’t even have a Robin, while the other universe would keep going with the Batman Incorporated idea.

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Technically they were already doing that with the Earth One OGNs, but I totally see your point.

Similarly, I always thought the question of “how does Bruce have a 10 year-old son in a 5 year timeline” could be fixed by doing a Batman Begins style origin where Bruce briefly trained with Ra’s al Ghul, he met Talia and they got together. When Bruce realizes just how cray them and the League of Assassins/Shadows are, he peaces out, not knowing about the little bundle of “joy” he left on Talia.

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Oh, don’t even get me started on how the New 52 universe wasn’t Earth One! As far as I’m concerned, that’s a major editorial blunder, and it has rendered the Earth One graphic novels pointless (even more so than their terrible release schedules). Why should we read these individual books when the entire DCU just did the same thing?

Anyways, carry on. Just ignore me while I yell at this cloud. :stuck_out_tongue:

I would have edited it to “Fanboy yells at cloud,” but I’m feeling too lazy. :stuck_out_tongue:

I still enjoy the Earth One books – sure the releases are sporadic, but I enjoy them for their longer, unique takes on characters. The only one I was kinda “eh” on was the Teen Titans ones.

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Honestly, my snark at the art notwithstanding, this issue was pretty solidly my favorite, so the fact that it was produced under such difficult circumstances makes it even more impressive.

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More tie-ins today. Green Arrow was first rate, Lemire and Sorrentino where really a high-point on this title and Zero Year works well for Ollie and Digs. Story is pretty standard, but delivery was great. Also hit Action 25. Greg Pak writes a very nice Superman book, and Aaron Kuder is enjoyable. I’d take this over that pile of “stuff” we got from Miller’s Superman Year One anytime. This Clark is inexperienced, gets in over his head, doesn’t always make the best decisions, but he’s always trying to do right. I also like Pak’s take on Lana.

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Agreed, Lemire’s run was definitely the highlight of New 52 Oliver. I remember Pak/Kuder’s Lana Lang – excuse me – Electrical Engineer Lana Lang to be pretty awesome as well.

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And her and Superman have a nice adventure with a monster that turns out to be just a cute little guy

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Detective Comics #25

It’s interesting, in a lot of ways this feels like if one were to take out a couple of details, this could have very easily been in the pages of Batman Year One. On one hand, it kind of makes it feel a little derivative of previous stories, but on the other, it’s well done enough that I can’t really say anything too bad about it.

The Flash #25

In some ways, this feels like one of the bigger stretches of future heroes to be in Gotham during this event; not just Barry, but also Iris West being there. In terms of Barry’s story in this, it is interesting seeing this more clean-cut cop/burgeoning hero clash with the morally grey Gotham City Police in the form of Bullock. Perhaps this is a spark that helps Barry decide to put on a mask?

One thing that is interesting about this, though, is how Manapul and Bucculato frame this issue as a transition. This is the last issue of their acclaimed and beloved run on The Flash, and not long after, they would move onto Detective Comics, which would have a stronger focus on Bullock and the drug Icarus would play a big role in their first arc. I may have to reread that run soon…

Green Arrow #25

A playboy billionaire returns home after being gone for so long the rest of the world thinks he’s dead, honing his body and mind and training for what will become a dedicated war on crime, armed with his…trick arrows?

While it is again kind of funny to see another will-be hero being in Gotham at this time, I do like that it’s for a specific purpose to get Oliver’s mother out of there. It was fun seeing Oliver interact with Bruce, especially when they’re sniping each other as they take turns punching out Killer Moth.

(That said, it is a slight knock that they seem to have this interesting take on Killer Moth and it just doesn’t really get the space to be shown.)

It’s also interesting seeing how similar and yet how different this issue and really the Lemire run in general was to the TV show Arrow going on at the time. Moira plays a big role, but not as corrupt. Diggle is there, but starts out as Moira’s bodyguard and seems to move away after Roy enters the picture. It would have been cool if we saw some of the Lemire run in the show – certainly would have preferred the Outsiders War over the crap we got with Damien Dahrk…

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Green Lantern Corps #25

I really enjoyed this issue. A solid reason to see John Stewart in this situation, and it was a great character study of the character, showing how his time in the Marine Corps, both the good and the bad, shaped him into the man he will become. The backstory around his mother was also really well done.

Anarky was also a decent enough antagonist in this, though I think his scheme wasn’t fully explained. At first I thought the idea was that he was kidnapping the rich and affluent and throwing them in the cages that John and his troop were in, but then it looked like he was just imprisoning all of the poor that was in there? It’s a shame, because before that he was working pretty well, talking about understandable injustice and crimes committed by the rich and politically connected against the poor of the city, something similar to what John’s mother instilled in him, but executed in a horrific way.

I also thought the random Batman cameo at the end was a little shoehorned in. Like, it probably would have been corny if Batman showed up at the end and talked to John, but at least there would have been a point to it other than “if there’s Batman in the page we might sell a couple thousand more copies.”

Nightwing #25

While Haly’s Circus also being in Gotham just as the storm hits is a bit coincidental, this was interesting enough. There was the germ of a good character arc in this where Dick learns that just because he has the talent doesn’t mean he can overpower others, though there really isn’t a lot that really shows him why he would learn that lesson. Maybe if the other teens that were around him did more to save the day other than help keep him alive after the initial riot?

Red Hood & The Outlaws #25

It’s been a while since I read any of this run, and seeing stuff like the All-Caste and Talia talking about Ducra threw me off for half a second, so I can only imagine what it would be like for someone who hasn’t been reading this series and picking it up for the Zero Year tie-in. Still, not a bad story. I liked the exploration of the struggle that Jason goes through to try to survive in Gotham and protect his mother (though part of me wishes the story he talks about would have been the one seen in Batman #0, which as I recall Tynion co-wrote).

And today marks the last week of the first World of Bats Casefile! First I want to say thanks to everyone who’s participated this month. It was something a little different, and I hope you all enjoyed it. :slight_smile:

Links for the last four issues are at the top of the thread. Here are the discussion questions:

  • Here we have the ending to this epic tale. What did you think of the finale? Did it live up to everything it set up, or did it leave you wanting?

  • What was your favorite moment in these issues, and from the weeks prior?

  • Now that we have finished the entire story, what are your thoughts on “Zero Year” as a whole? How would you compare it to previous Batman origin stories?

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Well, as I said last time, I think the story might have been better-served by ending with Dark City. I think origins are stronger as smaller-scale, more personal stories, so doing this whole pseudo-No Man’s Land thing probably wasn’t the best idea.

But while I think this portion of the story was ill-advised, it was quite well-written for what it was. I think I have the fewest specific problems with it of the three parts. I guess if I had to raise one more point, the Riddler’s ultimate plan seems to defeat the point of what he’d done before. I can see the idea of creating an environment where people have to get smart to survive. I think the Riddler might not give people other than him that much credit, but it’s not an untenable interpretation of the character. But then he just decides to blow everyone up anyway.

Well, the fun part of any Riddler story is the riddles, so I like the Ouroboros (which is ironically causing my spellcheck to twist itself into circles trying to figure out what I’m trying to spell: its best guesses are “Bosporus” and “Borobudur”) riddle challenge.

I think it has some good ideas, but like Knox said, it’s overcompensating for Year One’s being too small and grounded by trying to be too BIG and EPIC. It’s trying to be both Year One and No Man’s Land at the same time, and it doesn’t really live up to either. There are a lot of parts I like but it’s definitely not my favorite. If I had to pick a favorite Batman origin, I’d actually be inclined to say the original two-page “It’s an omen! I shall become a bat!” one from 1939. Maybe Mask of the Phantasm if we’re counting adaptations.

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