How can you possibly argue that? If Diana wasn’t in the movie, Max would’ve still gotten the stone and granted all those wishes, but w/out her there to convince him to renounce his wish, the missiles would’ve landed, killing countless people. She literally prevented full-blown nuclear war
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That is something any superhero character could have done. Nothing about that decision was unique to her. Beyond that, nothing she did led to Max being in that position in the first place. She REACTED to that situation, but she did not impact it. She was responding to that, but not making any active decisions to shape the plot overall. That is a passive character.
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I think I understand a little better, but there’s a difference between saying that a character isn’t taking an active, unique role and saying that they have no impact at all. Some of your wording made me think you were arguing for the latter, but I can see now that it’s the former. I still can’t say I fully agree w/ it, but that argument at least has more validity
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Truth is kinda Diana’s thing. Geoff Johns (who co-wrote this film) likes to focus on a central theme related to each superhero he writes, identifying that theme as the essence of the character. In this case, no other hero could have saved the day because none of the other heroes represent truth as distinctly as Wonder Woman does.
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I really liked it. Just a continuation of this WW. It’s also cool to know Snyder has a ton of extra Diana/WW, so we get to see more Gal Godot. I’ll definitely be watching this one again and buying it on 4K Blu-ray.
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That’s fair. I would say beyond the resolution as you put, Diana really didn’t have any impact on the narrative tho. She was just reacting to the things other characters did. But she never made any active decisions that had major impacts on the plot. I mean we knew the resolution had to happen because its in the past. That’s not really impacted to me.
I’m not trying to take away from other people’s enjoyment of the film. I’m so happy for everyone who enjoyed it. But I think it could have used a LOT of more rewrites to be an engaging and balanced story with a good protagonist. Wonder Woman deserves better in my opinion.
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Listen. I love Diana, but she symbolizes far more than just truth. Tons of superheroes represent truth. 2/3s of the Trinity. Diana is symbolic of so kuch more. Someone who defends the small people on the battle field and in the congress room. She cares for each individual deeply. She represents the strength, compassion, and love. Being an idol for women everywhere. Boiling it down to just truth doesn’t really cut it in my eyes. Beyond that, she still could have had more impact on the narrative and played a more active role overall.
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I mean, you can argue with the Geoff Johns approach to writing superheroes as the patron gods of certain virtues, but I don’t think you can really argue that the film fails to convey the idea that Diana uniquely embodies the virtue of truth.
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I feel like I could argue against that. Truth wasnt really something that was discussed at all in the story. The story was far more about greed. Maxwell symbolizing the destruction that comes with a greed-filled vision of life. Another example of this is Steve telling her to give him up for the greater good and being selfless. I can’t think of a single time where truth saved the day in this film. And as I already said, Diana never had an issue with being selfless throughout the film. It wasnt an arc for a character.
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Did you watch a different cut of the movie?!
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I literally explained my reasoning for why truth isn’t a part of the narrative afterwards. At least address my actual points.
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EDIT: I’m cutting this remark for being too harsh.
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Explain why my points aren’t honest then. What do i have to gain from being dishonest here? I love the wonder woman character. I want this film to be fantastic. None of my points are deceitful in my eyes. But genuine reactions and interpretations from what i saw.
I know you’re a good person Alexander, but I’m genuinely insulted by you trying to belittle my character here. At least give me a little respect in understanding that my points are genuine whether or not you agree.
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When the movie spells out the theme of truth (and its understanding of truth, in contrast to dishonest gain) in the first scene of the film, then proceeds to show the self-destructiveness of sacrificing truth for dishonest gain, and then ends with Diana causing everybody on the face of the planet to face the truth and give up their selfish dishonesty, I would most certainly say that there’s no fair interpretation of the movie that can ignore it.
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As I said, i saw all ofthosse moments showcasing the issues with greed and being self-centered. Not with dishonesty. I expained that in my original response to you.
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Greed is explicitly presented as the antithesis of truth in the movie. You can disagree with that understanding of greed and truth, but it is how the film defines its themes.
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Fine, I’ll agree with that. But once again, i dont think Diana is the only character that could have addressed those issues. Nor did she experience an arc where she needed to learn this lesson beyond the opening scene. Nothing she did in the main narrative led to the plot unfolding the way it did. We can disagree on what Diana symbolizes (stuff like that is personal and totally up to interpretation with no right answer). But Diana did not play an active role in the narrative on a character level. She reacted to the decisions of others. She is a passive a character. That is what i was originally saying and stand by.
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So I reaaaaally wanted to love this film, and after watching it, it was just okay. In fact I am more disappointed than not with this one. It felt long and drawn out in spots (if felt like her learning to fly took 15 minutes of screen time). The end was a huge mess in my opinion. Why did some stuff just disappear, but other things people had to deal with the consequences of the things they wished for? Why does her lasso do crazy things we have never seen like literally turning into three lassos at once (it seemed like).
The CGI was a bit bad and the circus performance fight scene at the end lacked in my opinion. As far as DCEU goes, I rate it right above Suicide Squad… Definitely not the movie I was hoping it would be.
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Just finished watching the movie, I really enjoy watching it, it has alot of great action and storytelling, This movie is the new Dark Knight film in my opinion.
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Overall I very much enjoyed the movie. Some parts may have dragged a little, and part of me is a little bummed that it kind of flies in the face of “abandoned the world” stuff that Snyder established in BVS (though it takes some lengths to kind of massage why no one knows of her), it was a really great character study of Diana and I think this is literally the best take on Maxwell Lord since his JLI days.
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