“the guy who killed Batman’s parents saved tons of lives”

this wasn’t my thought I saw this on reddit but after thinking about it, it’s pretty true. The death of Bruce Wayne’s parents caused him to become Batman and clean up the streets of Gotham. Some might argue without Batman we wouldn’t have super villains either and because of his creation he’s cost lives. What’s your opinion?


I’m somehow not at all surprised.

DC has characters which can swing from bad today and to good the next.

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So, on one hand, Batman’s creation led to a near total end of the Falcone family’s power in Gotham, saving who knows how many. He’s also put a stop to plenty of drug deals, muggings, etc.

In the other, most supervillains do have some sort of tie to Bats, and would most likely not exist, at least not to the extremes in which they do, had it not been for the Dark Knight. As Gordon points out in Batman Begins, it’s simple escalation.

But back on the first hand, Batman has saved the universe, and in fact the Multiverse, several times over. Without that night in crime alley, who knows what sorry state the cosmos would be in.


I don’t buy the “Batman creates his own villains” argument. It feels like some kind of half-baked meta-commentary that makes no sense at all in-universe. I mean, the Penguin, the Riddler, Two-Face, Poison Ivy, Mister Freeze, Man-Bat, Bane, Killer Croc, and the Scarecrow all have origins that don’t particularly require Batman’s involvement to happen, and there’s always Ra’s al Ghul to consider as well. Even the Joker probably would’ve had his one bad day at some point if he was that close to snapping to begin with.


TornadoSoup has a good point. Look at the what went down between Year One and Long Halloween where things transitioned between the Falcones and Maronis ruling Gotham crime to freakshows like the Joker and Two-face. Gotham is still a crappy place to live that makes Detroit look like paradise.

Batman is arguably more successful at fighting greater scope universe ending threats like Darkseid and the Anti-Monitor than small scale Gotham.

I dunno if that transition is Batman’s fault, the BTAS trial episode makes a good case its not, but I think he has better results in the JL than in Gotham

I’m not giving Joe Chill or Lew Moxon (or Jack Napier) any awards for killing the Waynes.

And as for whether or not Batman is to blame for the escalation of supervillains in Gotham, all I can say is this: in the Golden Age, the only big villains Batman faced at first were two mad scientists and a vampire. It was when a little boy in green hot pants appeared at his side that all of the big rogues started arriving. Batman didn’t create his villains. Robin did. Blame Dick.

Yeah, blame Dick, the… uh… um… er (an insult is on the tip of my tongue, I know it)… jerk!

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Joe Chill > Batman