The Dark Underbelly of Comics: Dynamite Entertainment and Being Attacked by Comicsgaters

I’ve been shocked that there haven’t been any articles about this yet, especially since major comics companies are pulling out, so I felt like I had to share what happened and give my personal experience with it.

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Don’t forget when they went after Darwyn Cooke’s widow after she denied their claims that he would be on their side.

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The creators claim to be comicsgaters and most of the people attacking me had comicsgate in their pfp, or followed one of the comicsgate leaders.

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I could add that they’ve doxed writers like Gail Simone too. It’s VILE. I just wanted to limit my discussion to what happened yesterday.

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@AlexanderKnox, Thanks for the extra information. It certainly sounds like it is prone to getting worse than the initial comic page shown. My defense of the comic is purely from what I saw there.

I think of all the comics I have enjoyed that have had biting riffs on people that I would be opposed to politically, Transmetropolitan pulls few punches and I loved that series. Preacher ruthlessly used parody characters to judge people and that comic was gold. Even the current Mark Russell comics, from Snagglepuss to Flintstones to the Sinestro one-shot, to Billionaire Island and Second Coming all cast tough glances at the sources of societal evils, from the perspective of the author. I like comics that go right up to the line and mock people who ought to be mocked, so I don’t want to make that a line I won’t cross

The author of Cash Grab certainly sounds like the kind of guy I will disagree with about many things, but the evils of society, as he perceives them, ought to be fair game for parody or satire. Since I don’t see the same concerns he does, I’m unlikely to ever buy his comic, but if he is just making exaggerations of social justice warriors to mock the things he dislikes about how they go about their work, I support his right to do so.

My indignation is a precious commodity and I intend to hold it in reserve until it is really needed. Let him make his crappy comic for his crappy friends and they can dance around in their echo chamber. As I said in my other post, when they start attacking social justice itself instead of its supporters, that’s when I’ll start worrying about him.

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Have you heard of Gamergate? Essentially the same crowd, but now targeting creators and critics in the comic book medium. They were the ones who were up in arms over the Marvel NOW and All-New, All-Different Marvel stories. Unfortunately, that led a lot of them to come over to the Distinguished Competition until we let them know that harassers weren’t welcome.

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I’m sorry you’ve been targeted, Nathan. They say you can tell a lot about a person’s character by the enemies they make. You’re on the right side.

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I knew this was a problem with gaming fans, I just didn’t know that they had made their way to comics as well.

I see the comments made anytime they cast someone who isn’t a white male as a superhero, and hoped that was just a small minority of ‘fans’. I still hope that. It’s disheartening to know this is even a thing that exists, but it’s good to know. Something to keep an eye out for and metaphorically punch in the mouth whenever we see it.

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I am so sorry they came after you, Nathan. I have been on Twitter for ten years and my experience there has been good over all, but once I came under attack from trolls simply for announcing the death of someone I love. It didn’t seem to matter to them that it was literally the worst day of my life.

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For those saying “I’m sorry for you,” don’t be. I made the decision to spread how horrible they are and got targeted. What sucks WAY more than my twitter notifications (which continued to be crazy today) is how much more people like Gail Simone have to go through.

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I’ve had experiences with these people as well, but not at your level. It’s one reason I dont do social media. To quote a movie many of them hate “there’s more of us than there are of them.” Having said that, I’m not a fan of censorship in any form. If we censor and cancel what they create, it makes it easier for others to censor what we enjoy.

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I’m thinking “sorry” because you should be able to disagree and voice your opinion without getting that kinda treatment.

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Star Wars totally stole that from the Hebrew Bible, though. :stuck_out_tongue:

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As I said on discord, I didn’t know these people were a group until today so I don’t know how effective they are. I have seen people complaining about too much/forced diversity but going about it this way is just stupid. Say your opinion and that’s it. Don’t go around spamming somebody with hatred and whining and trollish behavior. They are the equivalent of the little annoying kid on an airplane that runs up and down the aisle smacking each seat. Everyone wants to throw him off the plane. Don’t be that kid.

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Thanks for posting this thread. I saw some stuff on Twitter but I wasn’t really sure what was going on. Thanks for explaining. And I’m sorry you got targeted.

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If you want a good idea of how this group can be petty and inane, look up “Make Mine Milkshake.” And that’s a fairly tame (if utterly absurd) example of their behavior.

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I don’t have the time/energy to waste on them, hahaha.

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@Nathan.Payson

Well this got me to pop my twitter cherry this morning and I gotta say, I don’t feel like I’m missing much by not having a presence on social media. I think I’ve heard of this comicgate thing maybe from a EVS video(I just watch a bunch of comic artist videos). I don’t know the guy and while I don’t care for some of his rhetoric, I like some of his artwork. I get that some people can’t separate the art from the artist though, and it may vary given the subject. I certainly don’t care for the STFU comment he gave you. It’s strange to see all the hypocrisy (on both sides) with things. People demand tolerance but are unwilling to be tolerant of alternative views themselves. People like EVS and others on that thread arguing the importance to have freedom of speech, but then tell you to be quiet. I just saw your last post, so I won’t say sorry. Our paths haven’t crossed on here in quite a while, but I know you to be a good person and it’s a bummer to see you get harassed like this.

Before venturing onto tweeter and just looking at the comic page I could see why someone would be very upset with it. I’ve grown up watching South Park though and saw it mentioned on here. When first looking at the comic page my initial thought was that this character was a spoof of sorts and that he was being used much like how they use Cartman to address certain perspectives. Using him as a literary tool, playing the role of an ignorant person to poke fun and allow for such topics to be done. But after seeing the comments, not so much from the creator but simply because he (retweeted?) your post, it does seem like it was meant to evoke people. While I strongly believe that if you are not threating or promoting others to commit acts of violence, you should be able to say whatever you want in this country even if it may offend another. But I do feel that he should have asked (not demanded) people to not attack you. IDK people may have felt personally attacked by your comments. Perhaps they just saw it as funny, not seeing it through another lens, and felt you were calling them racist and phobic when you don’t know them or their experiences or loved ones. They don’t know you either though and it would be good for everyone to stop and try considering why the person with the opposing argument feels the way they do before lashing out. We are all just people, I’m guilty of getting heated with certain subjects. I’ve done it with you. It can be hard to separate your emotions from the discussion sometimes especially when it’s coming from personal experiences.

IDK, try not to let those people get you riled up. I know it’s easier said than done, but you have a good head on your shoulders, don’t play into their games and give them ammo. You can state your point while throwing butter and honey at ‘em. If they don’t pick up on what your saying let them frolic in the woods, the bears and bees with find them sooner than later (that’s a tad dark metaphor) :laughing:.

Somewhat Off Topic:

If the bad vibes have got ya down or just everything gong on out there in general maybe see if there’s something good you can do for someone else. I’m sure you do that kind of stuff, it’s just that while it’s good to do good, it can also help make you feel better by doing it. The art club just put together some “Get Well Soon” art for CynicalPink and it might bring ya a laugh. Besides the great art, a lot of them are adorable and funny. I don’t know if you doodle but it may cheer you up to put something together for CP, I know it would make her day. In my hometown a handful of us get together every year through our Home Builders Association and build things like handicap ramps and remodel bathrooms to be handicap accessible. Carpenter skills aren’t required if you don’t have them, you can help run material, just be the guy holding a board or sheet of drywall while it gets secured, or just be the cleanup guy (they’re the real heroes :laughing:). Habitat for Humanity is another great place to do some good. I wired my first house when I was 18 working with them. It was great experience and they help low income areas. Heck even if you’re not next to the beach, just going to your local gas station and picking up trash is a super simple good deed that will make ya feel better.

Completely Off Topic:

Have you heard any news on a season 4 for Dragon Prince or update on the video game? I remember hearing that there were allegations regarding the creator and issues with mistreatment of employees. I hope we can still get more of DP whether it be with him or not. Also what was with that Milk Shake video, was there more context to it? :thinking:

Any who, Sorry for all the rambling. If you made it to the bottom here you should see if the mods will give you reward tokens for the word count. :joy:
I saw you got into college, congratulations man! I hope it was one high up on your wish list.

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I am zero percent surprised a group with these beliefs exists, but had no idea they organized in to a group with a name and all. The trolls always like a name to get attention with.

Thanks for bringing this to the community so others not aware of the group can have it brought to our attention. This is such a nice community you forget what else goes on out there.

As always, f*** the entitled little incels who think everyone not like them is taking something away from them, and thank you to writers who write stories with diverse casts so more people can see themselves on comic pages and fall in love with the works.

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Hey @Aquamon!!! It’s so wonderful to see your name pop up!! I’m going to break this down in the order you wrote stuff so I can separate the off-topic stuff from the on-topic stuff.

Ethan Van Shriver is often viewed as the leader of Comicsgate and is responsible for creating most of the movement (View the article I linked above for more details).

We talk about cancel culture a lot and some of the worries about it, but there is a legit question about who we want to write and draw our comics. Ethan Van Shriver uses his platform to attack people like me and create a community that exists to create the ideal comic of “white supremacy” I’m exaggerating a teeny bit, but not much. What would a book supporting white supremacy look like? and how would you try to hide it’s presence? You write your honest thoughts and then tweak them to appear comedic. When in actuality they are written from a place of hate. This “satire” punches down, it attacks minorities for who they are rather than the treatment of minorities. South Park makes racist jokes all the time that make it hard to enjoy, but often they punch up satirizing racist people like Cartman. The comic he’s writing not only includes women in a demeaning fashion, but it also punches down at black lives matter and the day to day horrible treatment of Black America. Jokes like “I don’t want to add to their oppression” when discussing how a redhead is supposedly black is crass and horrible on so many levels. There are levels to satire and this beyond pushes it over the edge. Many people on twitter feel the same way which is why various writers like Mark Russell are pulling completely away from Dynamite for supporting this. And I have to ask, is someone who tweets about celebrating pissing off “S J Ws” and celebrates that he pissed off Mark Russel enough to have him “commit career suicide” someone you want writing comics? Especially in an industry which is notoriously cruel to non-white cis male writers and artist. Here an image and an article to make that clear.

Comicsgate argues that the inclusion of minority writers in comics is dangerous. When you dox female writers to try to make them quit, is that freedom of speech? There are limits to free speech (ex. You can’t scream FIRE in a crowded theatre) and advocating for racism and homophobia and harassing women crosses that line. Hate Speech doesn’t fall under free speech according to the supreme court. You can argue whether targeting writers of color with harassment is hate speech, an act of hate, or not, but it certainly dangerous and shameful.

I think this comment very much is in agreement with the above statement.

I think the difference between what you are saying and this is that these are Comicsgaters. It’s a little like if the KKK or Nazis attack you. Comicsgate is certainly less extreme, but it still follows the patterns of various alt-right groups and is considered by many comics reporters to be alt-right. These aren’t people who’s feelings were hurt; these are people who want to piss of liberals and attack them.

HAHA. This is true, but we hopefully agree that there is a difference between a heated intellectual discussion and a hate-motivated one.

That’s quite the metaphor HAHA.

Thanks for the advice. I’m actually having a great two months. Everything I do in preparation for college excites me and everything I do for myself also excites me. I so admire people who participate in charities like you because you guys do AMAZING work, and @CynicalPink I hope you get better!!!

You will be pleased to know that there is a Dragon Prince Comic-Con Panel at SDCC@Home this Friday AND you can watch it LIVE!!!.

You recalled that correctly. When I talk about cancel culture earlier, it’s important to note there is a level to which someone should or shouldn’t be canceled. When James Gunn’s tweets came out, he was “canceled,” however, many viewed that he’d proved that he had changed, grown, and learned. Similarly, many people who make mistakes change, grow, and learn. I am under the impression that the creator of Dragon Prince has grown and become a better person, the sheer diversity in the work and it’s unapologizing diversity and representation are proof of that. Ethan Van Shrier on the other hand supports Comicsgaters (his community) harassing women and clearly hasn’t changed. I think it’s safe to say that cancels worthy.

Look at the article I posted for more context.

I want that token!!! Also thanks for the support! I tried to make the best choice I could with the options I was given.

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