Dick Grayson and Batgirl, or him and Starfire

Bluelanternofsector2814 · February 5, 2020, 4:01am

Vote below

E.Nygma · February 7, 2020, 1:15am

Batgirl. Maybe a Bat Family thing. Maybe it’s the no power thing. But I also feel like they just feel more like a real couple. Him and Starfire feel like a celebrity couple.

OfLittleFaith · February 7, 2020, 10:06am

In all honesty, I think Dick Grayson’s best position is where he is now. It’s easy to love Dick Grayson because so many have done it. But Bea Bennett loves Ric Grayson, and Ric Grayson objectively sucks. Get you someone who loves you when you’re Ric Grayson.

But of the two you asked? I’d have to go Barbara. It’s not so much that I think they’re the quote-unquote “Better Couple,” but rather they’re both a bundle of neuroses, and having them together acts as a mutual quarantine so no one else gets hurt. Starfire? She could actually make someone happy. And you know that ain’t gonna fly in a Batfamily situation.

Bullcan · February 7, 2020, 2:31pm

Batgirl

ImTooIndecisiveTooPickAName · February 7, 2020, 5:40pm

Batgirl. I honestly want Starfire with Arsenal

ImTooIndecisiveTooPickAName · February 7, 2020, 5:40pm

And Batgirl just gets him

Chaoticmuse · February 7, 2020, 8:33pm

Mm. Batgirl I guess? They really need to strike a consistent tone though (I know, asking a lot) because man… Dick’s done some truly, truly awful stuff to both. He’s straight out dodged the question TWICE from Starfire on if he loved her enough to be the One and Only forever, and for Babs… I still think the worst one was sleeping with her post shooting when he was coming to deliver Babs her invite to his wedding…

BatJamags · February 7, 2020, 9:43pm

Dick and Babs worked better Pre-Flashpoint. With him as Nightwing and her as Oracle, it felt like they’d both moved on from when they first met, grown as people, and then found each other again. It doesn’t really feel right anymore. Then again, I’ve never thought Starfire was interesting at all. I don’t actively dislike her, but she could disappear entirely and I wouldn’t really care.

So… I guess still Dick and Babs?

J3D28F.17202 · February 8, 2020, 2:25am

Dick and Kory, hands down. It’s not even a competition for me. I’ve discussed this point at length on another longstanding thread about this very same topic.

J3D28F.17202 · February 8, 2020, 2:55am

To be fair, the part where Dick sleeps with Babs post-the Killing Joke and inviting her to his and Kory’s wedding the morning after was a retcon; the product of the 90’s Nightwing series’s mandate to prove that Dick and Babs had always been in love, even when they were both engaged to marry other people. For most of the more and 15 years that Dick was primarily a Teen Titans character, he and Babs had not been depicted interacting at all.

As far as Kory, Dick in Teen Titans was going through growing pains and trying to live up to an unreasonable image he’d created in his mind. He had some development to go through before he was ready to move forward with his life. It was also well before he started to be depicted as a ladies man; that only came into existence when they needed to explain why he was dating/marrying someone else while, supposedly, only really having been in love with Babs.

FInding a consistent overall tone may be impossible because the fandom (including the professionals in charge) is so firmly divided over this issue.

c02goddess.16092 · February 8, 2020, 4:47am

Dick and Babs.

I love each character individually and especially together, even when they’re not ‘together’ together. However, I fully admit that there are stories that make them (all three of these characters really) look pretty bad… and quite a few of them are in the very same issue. Which is a shame, because that issue also has some fun moments. Sigh. My favorite Dick/Babs moments are typically from the Chuck Dixon era, although Gail Simone’s Convergence: Nightwing/Oracle got me back into reading DC comics.

14.41398 · February 9, 2020, 5:39am

Babs. That’s all.

BruceWaynesCplusParenting · February 9, 2020, 10:52am

Babs 100%

EverAJ · February 9, 2020, 1:29pm

Dick and Starfire no contest.
Dick and Babs have always felt more like a high school thing for me. And it’s always felt forced in my opinion I.E. Dick proposing to Babs while he’s set to marry Starfire. But Dick and Starfire, they’ve had their problems but they grow together. It’s a far more attainable status quo than someone you’ve had a crush on since you were kids and never acted on until adulthood. Dick and Babs don’t really have anything between each other when you truly look at it.

BatJamags · February 9, 2020, 7:03pm

So, I’ve actually been reading Marv Wolfman’s Titans on-and-off ever since I joined DCU in October '18.

Just yesterday, I read the stretch with the Mirage incident (I’ll spare you the gory details, but it involved a creepy stalker with shapeshifting powers and a crush on Dick - you can do the math; that part was largely played fur lulz in the actual comic, by the way) up through Dick and Kori’s attempted wedding.

And I knew that was a rough patch for the series, but wow it was so much worse than I expected. In particular, Kori’s behavior through the whole thing was absolutely horrifying. She’s petty, vindictive, seems to place the blame entirely on Dick for what happened to him, and she doesn’t let up until he proposes, which feels a lot like she was pressuring him into bribing her to win her back. Even the story itself acknowledges that the wedding is a bad idea, though it seems to place the blame entirely on Dick.

That’s outright abusive. Two days ago, my opinion of Starfire was fairly neutral, but now I’m so done with her. I’d chalk it up to a bad writing decision and ignore it like a certain Nightwing annual, but Wolfman created Starfire and had written her for thirteen straight years by that point. I think I can safely call his interpretation definitive.

anon52107441 · February 9, 2020, 7:45pm

Babs

capo-mage · February 9, 2020, 7:49pm

Not again…lol. It’s a debate that won’t stop. Koriand’r no doubt about it, with endless love for Babs. It’s still Starfire imho.

Behemoth · February 10, 2020, 12:50am

#babs4life

J3D28F.17202 · February 10, 2020, 11:37pm

Keep in mind, by that point, the former editor had jumped ship to newly-formed Image Comics, and the new people in charge had new objectives, mostly including throwing away everything that the previous guy was up to and doing something else. That’s a fairly common thing to happen when a new boss/person-in-charge comes along; anything held over from the previous boss will be credited to that guy and not you.

I’ve talked about this at length on other threads, but Dick was supposed to have a limited series in which he finally completed his personal journey, and it was to culminate with him proposing to Kory, followed by their wedding in the comics. All of that was thrown away, and thrown away so abruptly that the Flash comic released the month after the botched wedding issue featured Dick and Kory as guest stars, and refered to them as husband and wife.

If you’re going to look to Wolfman’s portrayal of Kory for a definitive interpretation, I honestly think you’re better off looking to before editorial mandates were forcing him to try to make lemonade out of rancid lemons.

EverAJ · February 11, 2020, 12:07am

THANK YOU!!!
I never knew any of this lil info and I’m living for it!